Mastering Attorney-Client Communication with Dimitrios Loukakis

In this episode, host Edith Nazarian is joined by communication specialist Dimitrios Loukakis to explore key strategies for effective client communication. Together, they discuss practical tools for building trust, ensuring clarity, and fostering stronger client relationships through impactful communication techniques.

Disclaimer: This video is for educational purposes only. The video is a general overview and is based on the opinion of Edith Nazarian. Every claim is distinct and the applicable law can vary from case to case and is dependent on multiple factors. This video is in no way intended as legal advice. This video does not create an attorney-client relationship.

Edith Nazarian, Attorney, Law Offices of Edith Nazarian, APC

Episode Transcript:

Edith Nazarian: Welcome to the Client Connection, where we help attorneys and clients bridge the gap between them to help increase case success. I’m your host, Edith Nazarian. I’m a criminal and immigration attorney based in Los Angeles. Today, we will be talking about communication and how attorneys and clients can help improve the communication between them. Tell me, do this. I have a very special guest, Dimitrios Loukakis, who is a communication specialist. Hi, Dimitrios. How are you?

Dimitrios Loukakis: Hello. I’m very well, thank you.

Edith Nazarian: Wonderful. I’m so excited to have you here. So a little bit about Dimitrios. He is a Los Angeles-based voice and communication specialist with a mission to coach others to become more confident and competent communicators. He’s taught actors and journalists at universities throughout the UK and the U.S. He’s coached numerous public speakers and presenters. Dimitrios trains individuals to speak in inspiring and strategic ways while offering practical communication tools that can be applied immediately. He is a lead trainer for the Moxie Institute and he has an excellent track record of working alongside companies like Microsoft, TDK and others to amplify their message through public speaking and storytelling. So Dimitrios, can I call you Dimitri? Is that fine, or what do you prefer?

Dimitrios Loukakis: Yes, yes. Most people who know me, they would call me Dimitri. I prefer Dimitri. You will find me Dimitrios online. Anything that’s written down, including my passport, it’s the very official version of my name. I’m Greek. It’s a Greek name. So that’s where these weird variations are coming from.

Edith Nazarian: Okay, wonderful.

Dimitrios Loukakis: Non-Verbal Communication Specialist

Edith Nazarian: So, Dimitri, now, when we’re talking about communication and you’re a communication specialist – I mean, that’s a pretty big topic. So can you please maybe define what we’ll be talking about?

Dimitrios Loukakis: Yes. So my specialism is specifically non-verbal communication. My studies are in voice – so when we talk about tone, when we talk about how we’re coming across vocally – this is pretty much part of my studies. And from that, I also expanded to things like body language. So different elements of what we call non-verbal communication.

Edith Nazarian: Okay, I love that because I feel like, when we were talking about this a little before, it’s not so much what you say, but how you say it. Right?

Dimitrios Loukakis: Exactly. Exactly. It’s about how we say what we say. So if you think of communication very broadly categorized in these two things: the “what” being the content – what might be included in an email, if you like, the words themselves that we use – that’s the “what.” I specialize in the “how” – so the tone of voice, the body language. And if you think in that written world, think of it as bold or italics, for example. The spacing in your email – the words would remain the same, but you have all these tools to direct the attention of the reader, or in my case, a listener. And these are the tools that I’m dealing with, and these are the tools that I specialize in – the nonverbal realm, if you like.

Why Good Communication Is Important

Edith Nazarian: Got it. Okay, that sounds great. I mean, in having this conversation, I think the “why” is really important – and this is why I really wanted us to talk today about why communication is important and what good communication should look like. And for me, the “why” is… if we have good communication, it is more likely that we’ll have a good relationship. And I feel like that’s so important for attorneys and clients to be able to communicate well with each other, because I believe that will help their relationship and in turn help the chances of their case doing well in general. Right. So that’s kind of my take on it. And I want to hear from you – you know, your thoughts – but also, in your opinion, what does good communication look like?

What Is Good Communication

Are You Being Understood?

Dimitrios Loukakis: So I like this. I like the concept of “good communication means good relationships.” And it is true, and it is something that also is very good at showing the value of good communication. So I would say… there is—I will zoom in, if I may, a little bit more into what we mean, what good communication looks like—by saying that there’s a few different levels of communication. And there is like a fundamental level of good communication, which means you’re not being misunderstood, in very simple terms. So what comes out of your mouth is what the other person actually hears. And we usually make this assumption that it would be the same, but it’s very often not the same. So let’s say a world where misunderstandings don’t happen is a world where communication is working very well. Okay. So that’s on the first level, if you like, of good communication.

Is It Brain Friendly?

Dimitrios Loukakis: The second thing is that as you’re speaking, I may be able to understand you without a misunderstanding, but you may not communicate—not you, just anyone—may not communicate in a what we call a “brain friendly” way. Communication is a practice that examines exchange of information in a very basic, fundamental level. So if you’re saying something, if you’re saying red and green—and I can understand red and green—but if it takes me a lot of effort, if it takes my brain a lot of energy to follow what it is you’re saying, then I’m unlikely to stay engaged. So this is when people start drifting off. So sometimes it could be that you throw a lot of technical language, which is, I suppose, more related to content than anything. Or sometimes you have a voice that is more very monotone. So is there a misunderstanding? No, I’m able to understand what it is you’re saying, but it becomes very difficult for me to pay attention to it because you don’t communicate in a very brain friendly way.

Does It Represent You Properly?

Dimitrios Loukakis: Third level is where I think you would include your definition of relationships, which has to do with how we’re coming across. Branding, if you like. So you may be able to communicate something. You’re getting the message across. It is done in an easy and brain friendly way. Yes, but does it represent you in the best way possible? Are you coming across as someone who is listening well, perhaps, or who is listening to your client very well. Are you coming across as someone that your client feels like you understand their case beyond the legal terms which may be floating in your head, but it’s definitely not floating in your client’s head? Do they feel like you have a good relationship with them? And that’s, I suppose, the third level beyond misunderstanding, brain friendly communication, is that kind of deeper level of connection that can be facilitated with good communication.

How to Manage Legal Terminology with Clients

Edith Nazarian: Got it. So you said a lot of interesting things just now, and thank you for bringing that down. I think it’s very useful. The second part, the second level that you were talking about, the first thing that came into my mind was legalese, right? So we have a client, they come in and we’re talking to them, and there are so many legal terms, so many legal terms. And you are tasked, as an attorney—we’re trained in this—we understand what extreme hardship is, for example, or exceptional and extremely unusual hardship—the difference—or parole, or various things, in our areas of practice. But when we have a client come in and we’re so used to saying these terms, but now we have to say it to a client who may have never heard of that term in their life. And what would you say would be the best practice to do in those types of cases when we have these quote unquote, legalese terms that we need to discuss with the client, which are, really necessary to their case.

Do They Need to Know This Term?

Dimitrios Loukakis: So I will say two things. The first thing is there are—well, there’s two filters. The first filter would be: how much do they need to know? Do they need to know this term? Do they need to know what it means? Because not all terms should be perfectly understood by the client.

Explain Terms When Necessary

The second thing is, there is a term that the client needs to understand, you need to explain to the client what each term means in plain and simple language.

Does the Client Mention When They Don’t Understand Something?

Now, this is sometimes… the issue is not usually the attorney’s inability to explain it. Usually, the attorney is so used to using this language, they don’t even know which words are not being understood.

So generally we have this thing of—sometimes when there is a lack of communication, there is an issue. Sometimes the clients themselves are too embarrassed to ask. So they’ll let you continue, they’ll nod in some of—well, I tend to call this performative listening. They tend to nod and smile—”Very good. Great.” Because they’re embarrassed to ask.

For me, this is the important part where the more interaction you have, the quicker you start spotting these cases. If you find yourself going into long monologues about what is happening, what is the strategy, what are the challenges, what is the paperwork that is required, what is the chances of us going this way versus that way? Whatever, all of that. And you realize the client has not said anything.

Ask the Client Open-Ended Questions

Ask them a few open-ended questions because that will tell you more about who they are, what are they thinking in terms of this. And this way, it will also feel to them that it’s less of you providing a service and them being on the passive end, but it will help them feel there is also more of a collaborative process, that they’re an active member in that relationship and that, as you mentioned earlier about relationships—that will also give them more ownership of what is happening and also empower them to ask more questions about the terms they don’t actually understand.

Edith Nazarian: So I really, really like that strategy and that tip that you just said, because, you know, for me when I have a meeting, I’ll always tell the client—or if I have a consultation, my first time meeting them, I tell them, “If there’s anything you don’t understand, please tell me.” Right. In a way, you know, that’s telling the client—in a way, putting it on the client to let you know what they’re thinking. But I really like what you just explained in, you know, one, let’s break things down to their fundamentals, right? Because we have to be conscious of who our audience is. And our audience typically—not always, sometimes they are attorneys, our clients. You know, there can be attorney clients. But when they’re not attorneys and they’re not used to these types of terms, you know, you have to be cognizant of that, aware of that so that you can better get your point across and make sure that they understand. And with asking open ended questions to make sure they’re following along, and incorporating their feedback into the conversation, that’s a great way of—it’s a great litmus test, I feel, to kind of feel, “Okay, do they understand? Do they understand what’s going on? And are they asking questions?” I think that’s really important. If you know, you know, maybe they don’t understand, but they just don’t feel like they should mention something as you’re talking. So I think that’s a really good point.

Ask the Client Their Opinion

Dimitrios Loukakis: And also it depends on the questions you ask them as well. I just need to be very clear that I don’t want people to ask, “Can you just tell me what you understand from this?” Because, of course, the client will feel like they’re being tested. Right? But if you ask them their opinion about what they think of this, and you can say, “I can also have my professional opinion, but I’d like to know, what do you think of this?”

It’s one of the most effective ways to get someone to feel validated, as well, to feel like their opinion matters. Because it does. What the client feels and thinks is actually important. Both of you need to be on board in that collaborative process. So it is important what they think and feel and perhaps they could have formed an opinion that is based on misunderstanding. And if you don’t ask them this, you will never find out. So it’s just bringing a lot more transparency to that whole process and it achieves a very good buy-in from the client, which is such a powerful tool in that relationship.

Edith Nazarian: So absolutely. I mean, I think I think when it comes to relationships, emotions are so key and critical. So if the client feels like you are listening to them, their opinion matters, it just helps the relationship between you so much more. So I really like that tip.

Non-Verbal Communication

Edith Nazarian: You are talking about nonverbal communication at the beginning, and I just would love to hear from you some examples of either good or—we’ll get into the bad—but some good examples of nonverbal communication that you think could really improve communication.

Dimitrios Loukakis: What are we looking for? In other terms. Right?

Edith Nazarian: So let’s say I have a client. I’m in a meeting, right. And they’re sitting across from me. Let’s say we’re sitting across from each other and I introduce myself and we start getting into their questions, or the case, or questions that they have. So let’s say I’m speaking. What sort of nonverbal communication tools can I use that will help the client know that, emotionally, that I care about what they’re saying or I care about their case or just things to let them know that this is a good relationship. This will be a good relationship.

Empathy Neurons

Dimitrios Loukakis: I will give you one tool I think is probably the most important tool. And there is a lot of research behind this, actually, the first research was… there was a study ‘92 in North Italy actually, and they studied how empathy works, basically. The brain function of empathy. And it comes from something, people call it neural resonance. It has a few different names, but it is essentially the idea that when we feel connected, similar neurons fire up in our brains, otherwise known sometimes as mirror neurons; some people call them empathy neurons.

The idea is that that experiment in—I think was ‘92, early nineties, but I think it was ‘92 in Italy—basically proved that if you—when it was done with monkeys, actually—when you see someone do something, if you start feeling and connecting with them, similar neurons are firing up in your brain even though you’re not actually going through that activity yourself. And this was the beginning of an explosion in neuroscience. And it basically means that in practice, when people feel connected—and you can see this in public spaces like restaurants, for example, or in parks—when people feel connected, they start assuming similar body positions. So you see them cross their legs the same way, or they’re kind of like touching their face the same way, they’re leaning on to the same side.

And that also works very vocally as well. When you see someone like, “Oh, I’m so excited about that,” you hear somebody else and you’re so excited, right? Like you have that same kind of vocal energy or vocal gesture sometimes we call it. And this is in a way, how we feel connected to each other. So what does that mean in practice for you as somebody’s walking in? And this happens very often, especially in cases of client and attorney relationships. A lot of the people that walk through your doors are going through a lot. Let’s just say that this is not the happiest moment for them, okay? They’re in trouble one way or another. Okay. It’s almost a bit like, you know, being in a hospital sometimes, like nobody chose to be there. Nobody woke up and said, “You know what? What would be great is to have a legal battle of sorts,” you know, like the kind of there because they kind of have to, or at least I’m assuming most of the cases.

And a big mistake that I see a lot of time—people going, “Hey, hello, how’s…” They’re trying to cheer them up. Which may come across—may start creating a disconnect. In a way, very different brains are firing up in you. Very different neurons are firing up in your brain comparing to theirs. And they see that disconnect and they go, “They’re not really listening. They don’t really understand my case.” So I would say, without of course going to the extreme of that and almost like mimicking them—we want to avoid that at all times, I just want to clarify—but some sort of, like, see where the position is in their body, see where they are vocally, and see if you can adopt, let’s say, a similar energy. And this can go a long way in them creating, setting up the stage, or creating the ideal circumstances for some connection to happen.

Think About the Client’s Situation

Edith Nazarian: So I love that because there’s so much of what you said that I resonate with, you know, in the work that I do. Definitely, we have people, clients who are going through so much—criminal and immigration. I mean, it’s almost within the anatomy of the practice areas. So, you know, what you said about empathy and mirroring. And I really, really think it’s all about thinking about the other person, right. Putting yourself in that person’s shoes when they walk in, you know, what are they going through? What are they going through and why are they there in your office? Why are they there? They need your help. And to keep that in mind and think about their situation. You know, it helps you, I think, with what you were saying, get into that empathetic zone and being able to mirror authentically. Right. Because you are thinking about them and you’re genuinely caring about their situation.

And by doing that, it kind of fosters, naturally, this good communication. Would you agree?

Dimitrios Loukakis: Yes, I agree. I would say you hit the nail on the head when you’re talking about essentially the most important rule—if one was to take away something—is understanding. Communication works best when we try to understand the other as deeply as possible. And that happens maybe before they even walk through the door. To try to understand what is happening with that person, what is likely their emotional state to be? And then the more information you receive, the more you have a better understanding of who they are, the more accurate you can be, and the better you can connect with them.

So it’s all about understanding the other, and you will find this in probably more things that we may or may not talk about later. But you’ve already found things in you know, when we talked talked earlier about jargon, legal jargon, perhaps. If I truly make an effort to understand you, then I may start filtering and start thinking about what type of language I’m using. If I try and genuinely understand you, then the connection will happen much, much earlier from the moment you walked in through the door.

So it’s all about understanding the other, being curious, being intrigued about the other, being less self-centered, less about, “What am I going to do, what I’m going to say,” and more about what’s happening over there with that person. You can’t go wrong if you do that.

Edith Nazarian: I love that and I completely agree. And I think it goes into the topic of being really intentional. You know, as we enter a meeting. And I love that you said even before a meeting, right? I mean, we have to be thinking about these things even before we see a client right? What the issue is, what are they going through?

You know, we typically will know what is happening to a client before they enter into the meeting. And thinking about their situation, being very intentional about the goal of the meeting and what they want to get out of it. What you want to get out of it, as well, as their attorney. It’s, I think, so critical. And by being intentional and thinking about these nonverbal communications between each other, you know, that I think will just help facilitate just a more effective and efficient case.

What Hinders Good Communication?

Edith Nazarian: We talked a lot about really, you know, what is communication, how can we improve communication. What are some tips for that? I want to know now, what do you think hinders communication and what can really get in the way of a relationship?

Unwillingness to Change

Dimitrios Loukakis: What can get in the way? In one word, the first thing I would mention is sometimes—and it’s personal, this, for people—our inability to change or an unwillingness to change.

So there is that idea of authenticity, which is a beautiful concept, but it can be very often misinterpreted. It’s very often misinterpreted because you say authenticity, and I can take that and call it complacency. Authenticity. I am who I am. I don’t need to change for anyone. I don’t need to change for people. I don’t need to do anything. How are you going to grow without change? How are you going to learn? How are you going to move forward?

It can be very, sometimes, tendencies to be more complacent, to be more, sometimes, dare we say lazy sometimes and say like start giving excuses for staying where we are because we like the comfort of a present moment and we’re not very keen on the discomfort of change. We may find the narratives that suit us, and sometimes the concept of authenticity I find can have that trap within that. I do believe in authenticity and communication, and that’s perhaps for another conversation.

But I think it’s more embracing the idea of change, embracing the idea of that you can be not just different, but more. You can achieve better this and better that, and you can be this person who achieves that. And that comes from—as you mentioned earlier—I really like the word that you mentioned: intention. That I intend to become someone who is deeply connected with their clients. I intend to have return clients because they come back to me because we have built that relationship. Or they can be active referrals out there in the industry for me because they sing my praises.

First of all, the mindset. The mindset of growing and moving forward. And not having that is, I would say, probably the number one reason that hinders people from growth. That’s the first thing.

Making Assumptions

And I will also mention one more thing. I won’t mention too many because we don’t have enough time, but I will mention one thing and that is assumptions. People make a lot of assumptions and in some way we can’t… we do make some basic assumptions, perhaps code of conduct that someone is going to come and arrive and be polite and all of that stuff.

But a lot of the times we move ahead by making a little bit too many assumptions. We assume that someone is in a certain place and we assume what they might be feeling. And first of all, yes, this may be the case. Oh, I assume they might be quite distressed. And they come, they’re actually pretty happy. They’re having a great day. Great, pivot, pivot fast. Right. So these assumptions, I say approach your interactions with a healthy amount of uncertainty, ask questions. And how does that feel for you and what is happening there.

The more information you have, the less assumptions you need to make, which means then your behaviors are more likely to be behaviors that will help you connect with your clients.

So assumptions, too many assumptions as we’re speaking. Even as we’re speaking, I see people, even in parties or social events or networking out there, people saying things about themselves that they assume the other person wants to hear. Not necessarily the case. That’s not the question they asked you. So that doesn’t mean that they’re interested in what you have to say about this. So be very careful about what you say and how you say. Not making assumptions about, hey, what the other person may want to hear or how they may want to hear it as well.

Edith Nazarian: I love how that connects with what we were talking about at the beginning. And you touched on this too, even—how, you know, if maybe a client is not saying something right, you can’t just assume they understand everything that you’re saying. Right.

Authenticity vs Unwillingness to Change

Edith Nazarian: So, you know, and and going into the authenticity/change topic that you mentioned, I think that’s a really interesting concept because, I mean, when I think of somebody being very stubborn and saying, you know, “I’m not going to change my ways, I mean, I’m being authentic”… where’s the line drawn, do you think, when someone is really being authentic and versus, you know, they’re just being really stubborn.

Dimitrios Loukakis: The line in what way?

Edith Nazarian: So where do you think the line should be drawn? Where do you think authenticity should be honored and where do you think it’s actually more of a hindrance in this situation when it comes to communicating?

Dimitrios Loukakis: So I prefer to not make a judgment on who the person is and what is the right amount.

The right amount is a personal choice, is defined by the person. The person may be more or less secure within themselves. They may be more able to embrace change than somebody else. And yes, there is a right amount. We’re not looking for people who are completely spineless. We’re not looking for people who will kind of like adapt to a situation so much depending on who they’re in front of. You don’t even know who this person is. Where are the morals, their sense of integrity, their sense of what is their identity? What is it that makes them?

So, absolutely, there is that side that says, “Hey, you are a person, you have your own principles, you have your own integrity, you are this person,” and it’s okay to stick to that as a vision of who you are. And on the other side, there is a sign that says, “Look, yes, you have all these things and you can improve these things and you can change them.” To anyone that resists this change, I tend to say that you do change more than you think.

So you’re already changing. The way you will speak to a five year old, the way you speak to your partner, the way you speak to your client, the way that you speak to someone that you just met at a party. These are all different ways and you use different voices and different words to communicate with all these people. So you’re already doing that. And what I do with my clients in training is we’re extending that to the different types of client, to the different professional circumstances that you find yourself in.

And we become more conscious of that process. So I would say, yes, there are the two extremes and if we start changing too much, the other person may go into panic and we don’t want that because that’s not a place where you can learn. I don’t believe in going out of your comfort zone, that you’re so far out of your comfort zone, you start losing it right? And nobody really talks about that. There is that danger, right?

And at the same time, we don’t want that to have such a narrow field within your definition of who you are and what you do, that you resisting any kind of change, which is where growth lies. So we need to find a good balance and through discussion, find out how ready the other person is to embrace how much change.

So I would just say there’s not a universal or right amount of change that is true for everyone. It depends on the person and even the time of their lives. Some people are just really tired and I have turned down customers who give me a vision of where they want to be and what they want to do, but they’ve just gone through a divorce or something and are just not ready for it.

How to Communicate a Disagreement with a Client

Edith Nazarian: I think in speaking about the authenticity and the change concept, it makes me think of times when I really had to stand my ground with a client. Or a potential client that we may not see eye to eye. So in those cases integrity tells me that I need to conduct my practice in a certain way. And my job is also to communicate with this client that I don’t see eye to eye with necessarily, in a professional way, of why what they’re saying, it just won’t work.

I mean, I remember I had somebody come in for a consultation with me and he was telling me how to do the case. He had seen so many different attorneys that he thought he knew exactly the way he had to do the case, how the case needed to be done. He just needed somebody to do it. And I looked at him and I said, you know, “I’m sorry, but I disagree. This is how I see it. And if you don’t see it that way, you know, we can’t work together.” And so it’s very important. I think authenticity is important.

And what you said is balancing this, finding the right in between, to say, okay, this is my truth. This is ethically, professionally what I stand behind. And if a client doesn’t maybe see eye to eye with you, it’s your job to communicate that. But in a way that doesn’t necessarily destroy a relationship. You never want to destroy a relationship. And still taking the tools that you were also discussing about being empathetic, still thinking about their situation.

Even when you’re having a disagreement with them, potentially, is thinking about where are they coming from. But telling your truth. And standing behind that, even if you don’t necessarily see each other from the same perspective.

Dimitrios Loukakis: Exactly. And I think in that case, this is a very interesting example that you bring up of like how to decide to not work with someone without ruining that relationship. And that can feel like a minefield. And sometimes it is.

I think it has to do with… I would say, first of all, your non-verbal communication should never come across as either disappointed or aggressive or anything like that. You should continue communicating with that same enthusiasm, even if you feel like this is unlikely to move forward. “You’re not going to be a client, are you?” You know, you might be thinking that, but you kind of need a sense of like, hey, “Do I want this person to still have a good relationship with this person?”

And if you do, I would say nonverbal should definitely reflect that. So open body language, if you stop smiling all of a sudden people will read that. People will pick that up very quickly. So keep that same nonverbal, open, polite and positive. And the second thing is that always offer options. So the client does not feel that they’re out of control, that you’re controlling the narrative. So we have a few options here.

You have one option, which is if you want this way, you know exactly what to do. You can have and represent yourself and this is what it entails. Option two is to find an attorney who will either fully agree with your strategy or is very willing to bypass their own strategy and offer you the flexibility that you might need right now. And there is the option three, which is to work together and go this way, etc., etc.

And then make sure, because people will not necessarily, again the assumption that they will hear what you just said, is to reaffirm in that moment that in all these cases, I want to make sure to say that I absolutely, really enjoyed working with you so far. I want what is best for you. And I think at the end you are the person who knows what’s best for you better than me.

So out of these three choices, I don’t want to make that choice for you. I really think the choice should be yours. And I will respect that choice because at the end of the day, if you believe one thing is better and I’m trying to shove another thing down your throat, that’s not going to work. I want you to be happy with the choice that you make. And then and also that this will not affect our relationship as we’ve built it.

Because I feel like we have a good relationship, we have a good connection. I think we communicate very well and that regardless of whether we’ll continue working together, I would not want that to change.

Edith Nazarian: Dmitri I 100% agree with that. I love how you just said that.

Dimitrios Loukakis: And this way it’s all on them. There’s no rivalry, there’s no like, “ooh, hard feelings.” But you need… if you just say, “Ooh, you know what, I think this may not work that well,” it is very likely for the other person to take it personally. Put it on them, it’s their choice. All you’re offering is clarity and transparency. And then when combined with that all good intention for the well-being of the person you have in front of them. It could be that they’re a nice person and maybe they can’t see beyond what their limited understanding is.

And that’s the same for all of us. We all function from a largely place of ignorance, for most things in the world. Like there’s so much in the world, I don’t know. But most things in the world, right. So it’s normal for people to kind of just get the wrong end of what is required and not knowing and with some a little bit unjustified, unsupported conviction. Just go in there guns blazing and kind of say, “I think this should be it.” And that’s okay. Perhaps this is an insecurity behind it. And lack of flexibility. That’s on them. Good intentions, study, listen, try to understand the other person and then communicate a clear way and I think this will go well.

Final Comments: Mastering Attorney-Client Communication with Dimitrios Loukakis

Edith Nazarian: I love that. Completely, completely agree. And I feel like a lot of what you’re saying just sounds like teamwork to me. You know, we’re both—attorneys, clients—we’re working together on the same thing. And we want the same, and good, end result. Right? And we really need to listen to each other and work with each other to do what’s best for both of us, and separately, but also together. Right?

So I think this was amazing. Thank you so much. Thank you so much, Dimitri. This was really lovely. We, I think, covered everything that we wanted to. And then some. So I wanted to ask you, though, if our listeners wanted to get in touch with you, what’s the best way to do so?

Dimitrios Loukakis: Okay, great, great question. Oh, well, I would say first go to my website. And so that’s Dimitriosloukakis.com – that will take you straight to my website. You can communicate, you can get in touch through that or just email me at loukakis@gmail.com would be the other way. You can email me through there as well.

And on my website I have more information about how I work with each client and what I do there. You can also find me on LinkedIn. Dimitrios Loukakis, you can find me there. Any of these ways are all good ways.

Edith Nazarian: Perfect. Dimitri, this was such a pleasure. And to everyone listening, if you enjoyed this episode, please feel free to follow and subscribe. And if you have any suggestions for future topics or future speakers that you’d like to hear from, please let me know at podcast@enlawoffices.com. Thank you for listening and watching, and till next time.